I guess nothing gets my goat more than a person who first creates a straw man characature of the beliefs of someone they disagree with, and then knocks it down with disdain. This tendency annoys me because it is the way so many Protestants behave in respect to Catholicism: “Oh, you Catholics all worship Mary and we know the Jesuits take a blood curdling oath of mindless obedience to the Pope and one day he’ll tell them to kill all the Protestants and they will…”
When doing apologetics work I always stress that Protestants should take the trouble to find out what Catholics really believe. Then if they disagree, fine, but at least they disagree with what Catholics really believe rather than what they think Catholics believe. The second position actually takes some humility, some curiosity, some mental work and some gracious patience and some genuine open mindedness. The other position is simply ignorant bigotry–whether it comes from an obviously ignorant bigot, or someone who is educated and culturally sophisticated.
To put it another way, it’s just as easy to be a snob about hor d’oevres as it is about hot dogs.
Let’s consider the idea that all creationists are trailer trash fundamentalists who think dinosaurs helped make the pyramids 3,000 years ago. Now I was actually brought up by fundamentalist creationists, and went to Bob Jones University where they taught us a young earth version of fundamentalist creationism. This was just about the most extreme form of fundamentalist creationism. I don’t think they believed that the dinosaur bones were planted in the ground by God to give the earth the illusion of age, but they did believe in a universal flood that made the climates what they are now and accounted for sea shell fossils on mountaintops and so forth.
My point is, they were just about the most extreme fundy creationists, but none of them argued that the earth was only 3000 years old and nobody thought the dinosaurs helped build the pyramids. They had a world view and a scientific explanation for how things are which (given their prior assumptions) was consistent. Where they had problems explaining their explanations stretched credibility. However the same things can be said of evolutionists: given their prior assumptions, their conclusions are consistent, and when their theories don’t have facts to support them their explanations also stretch credibility.
But those who hold to creationism are not all of the most extreme sort. There are many ‘theistic evolutionists’. These are people who believe that the theory of evolution explains some of the mechanics of the development of the natural world, but they believe God started it and controlled the process. Some believe his interaction was constant, some think it was sporadic. Some think he didn’t interfere at all, but simply set it all going.
My point is that there are a whole range of creationist viewpoints from the most wacko fundamentalist ones to ones which are very credible, and which stick to the facts and dont’ go further than science allows them to go one way or another. Indeed, every Catholic should be a ‘creationist’ inasumch as we must believe that God created the heaven and the earth. A Catholic may believe in the theory of evolution, but he may not believe that it happened by random accidents. He must also believe the creator God.
Before one blames Sarah Palin (or anybody else) for being a kooky fundamentalist creationist it might be less embarrassing if we stop and do the homework and try to discover just what she does believe and how much she has promoted her own views in state schools. On the other hand, we could just take the lazy route and believe what the journalists write about her.
“Theistic Evolutionist”… I like that.
Dinosaurs helped build the pyramids–where do they get this stuff? That sad part is that some people really do believe the theroy–very bizarre.
There is an intriguing overview of the Theory of Evolution in Ann Coulter’s latest book which makes the excellent point that is still just a theory. Unlike Einstein’s Theory of Relativity which has been proven on multiple accounts via experients Einstein himself said would prove it, evolution still has a long way to go before being confirmed. It may be confirmed in time, but it’s not quite there yet.
I keep wondering where these atheists got their FAITH in the belief if God does exist, then God would do something different. That is, God would fly around in a golden chariot or something and act like a superhero…. Try asking them why they think God should make Himself more obvious – and why they are sure that God wouldn’t have created the universe and us in exactly the way it is now?
3000 years ago?O come. Fiddlesticks. That's nothing. I believe that dinosaurs still exist. Please see here:http://farm1.static.flickr.com/22/27913001_47ce872dea.jpg?v=0here:http://www.safarinow.com/files/images/travel-guide/Archaeology%20&%20Palaeontology/300%20wide/Dinosaur-Park-at-Sudwala-Ca.jpgand here:http://www.ocf.berkeley.edu/~jtravis/pictures/l-Dinosaur%20Park.jpgI also believe that Bill Maher is noble and credible, that the Humble Obama is more luminous than he is letting us on about, and that Joe Biden and Nancy Pelosi are closet theologians more learned than Bishops and the Pope.Ahem, really, there is indeed more myth-mongering (in the bad sense) in evolution than there is in creation, which yet uses myth (in the good sense) often for expression. I mean, think about it. Those fundies who hold such strange views only have the details wrong, but the general idea they have right. The pure evolutionists though, they may even have the details wrong, or wrong in particular ways – and the only thing credited to them, sophistication.And why is it always 'evolution' as the explained process, and nothing else? Why this lack of other names? Maybe what appears as evolutionary is not evolutionary at all. Maybe it is creation on such a complex and particularized scale that it completely boggles the mind.
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Colbert says it all:http://www.colbertnation.com/the-colbert-report-videos/180122/august-28-2008/the-word—acid-flashbackSorry. I’m not voting for a young earth President who makes jabs at Obama for supporting touching education against child predators.
Excellent point.And, you know, it’s not just Protestants who create these mendacious caricatures of Catholics, but also the atheistic mobs who don’t differentiate between a peaceful, loving tradition, and the lunatics who carried out the September 11th attacks.BTW, I think the person who left you that comment was deliberately trying to get a rise out of you (and some attention).
Don’t take this the wrong way, old chap, but your time at Bob Jones was a while back. A lot’s changed, and now things like that are rampant among the sort who call themselves “Creationists”.
Fr L,I think on at least one level you could be as ardent in defending the faith with regard to creation through evolution, a catholic tenent if I understand correctly, as you are about life issues. It is important this truth of not denying evidence or pretending the fossils were planted by satan to deceive us.
Marcus, I didn’t actually express my own views at all in the post on creationism, but as I understand it, belief in evolution is not a Catholic dogma. It is a permissible opinion. In this debate there is a wide range of views–some crazy, some credible. We do well in the debate to find out what others really believe rather than assuming we know what they believe and then dismissing it with scorn. That sort of approach usually only embarrasses the person who take such a bigoted stance.That’s the point I am making.
I was thinking about this yesterday when my friend told me about a new popular game called Spore, which is essentially guiding evolution.http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spore_(game)
Aside from the Creationist point of this post, Fr. D, I am one of those curious cats who has to know the ins and outs of peoples beliefs.Your book does a good job at giving alot of these (Prot to Catholic) points a concise run-down.I appreciate the gift!-g-